The valley of ashes represents the most important thematic element and the purpose of the novel. It shows the superficiality and selfishness of the society. The wealthy surround themselves with lavish belongings, while the poor live "where ashes take the forms of houses and rising smoke" (27). This polluted area takes the characters' liveliness away as men move "dimly and [crumble] through the powdery air" (27). It is ironic that Nick meets Myrtle here for the first time, as she searches for a way to escape from this dim world. She spends most of her time with Tom pretending to be something she's not and hopes to indulge in a rich life. The valley of ashes represents the reality of society and the escape from the characters' superficial lives.
I agree with Jack that the valley of ashes isn't the most important symbol. It is, nonetheless, an important symbol. I think the valley is what Gatsby is left from his past that he can’t get away from. And I thought that the point Jack brought up is a good point in that Fitzgerald wouldn't identify the two societies as content with life.
I do not understand how the valley of ashes represents the superficiality of society. The valley of ashes seems more like the brokenness of society. It may represent reality, but this does not seem to tie to Gatsby’s story/life enough to be the main focus of the novel. His life had already been full of reality. I agree with Vasiliy: it is part of “the overall notions of Gatsby’s dream…. he can never escape from [his past].” The ashes is what he tried to escape and aviod throughout his life.
The valley of ashes does not so much represent superficiality itself but through its juxtaposition with Nicks world. I kind of agree, Julie, that is could be the brokenness of society but i interpret its purpose to be more for contrast. The roaring 20s are represented by times of unprecidented wealth living next to devasting poor. It is to show this tension in society, that Fitzgerald includes the valley of ashes.
Yes, the Valley of Ashes does represent "death and decay' but i do not think it represents the was the rich people lived. I view it more as the seperation of between the rich and the poor. It represents death because the poor, who live there, are thriving for something meterial rather than something actually meaningful and whenever that happens, it leads to some form of death.
I agree with Dustin. I don't think it represents really anything about the rich people in the novel, but more like someone said above with the juxtaposition. The comparison of the valley of ashes with "West Egg" and "East Egg" is the thing that points out the hopelessness of the rich people's lives. They see the way that people in the valley live and how much more they have, yet they are still filling their lives with meaningless things.
You can also see how the valley represents death and decay with Myrtle's death at the end. She lives in the valley and is pursuing everything superficial because she wants much more than she has, representing many of the people living in the valley. Eventually, this leads her to her death when she desperately pursues Tom in his car.
The valley of ashes is an important symbol - not the most important one. It shows the great contrast between the societies and also where Gatsby came from. I think Fitzgerald shows it to the audience so they can see what would make a young man, in this case James Gatz, want to leave that place and try to succed in the world.
Regardless of whether or not the valley shows superficiality, it shows a definite divide in the ways the people are living. While the "Eggers" are attending lavish parties, the people in the valley of ashes are constantly monitored by a pair of eyes that has been there for ages, examining the people. It definitely shows the presence of a hiererarchy within American society that everyone knows exists.
Gatsby's house is an important element throughout the novel. It shows that Gatsby is chasing his own dream that he can never reach. He is living in his past, however Daisy has moved on to live in the present based on superficiality. Gatsby tries to attract Daisy with his beautiful house and parties. Sadly, "Tom and Daisy-they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made..." (188). It as if Gatsby is cleaning up Daisy's mess when he takes the blame for killing Myrtle. Gatsby's house represents both his loyalty to Daisy and Daisy's superficiality.
Gatsby uses his house to attract Daisy's need for wealth. He throws all of his parties hoping that Daisy will show up to one and she never does. His "friends" show up and he doesnt know them nor does he care. He uses his house to persue the dream that is marrying Daisy
I agree with Hannah, I think the house, due to the fact that it is admired by both levels of classes ( the rich and the poor), represents the shallowness on both ends of the different classes in the book. It serves as an elimination to pure honesty in both spectrums of society. The rich attend Gatsby's parties to maintain their prestigous status, and the poor admire his house because they think expensive possesions (things they don't have) define and create happiness in someone's life. His house efficiently marks the corruption on both ends of the community. Most of all, however, Gatsby's house represents the deep insincerity and materialistic ways within himself. He upholds such a high standard of living not because he enjoys it, but to attract attention and admiration. He does not want friends, he wants fans, and by surrounding himself with people desperate to experience an extravagant lifestyle by attracting them with ridiculous measures and examples of his wealth, he doesnt allow any true reflection of himself or a substantial friend around him. By protecting himself with people that are so desperate to be something their not, he detaches himself from reality and lives in some surreal place he built for himself with money.
Gatsby's house shows how attracted people were to wealth and status. After they meet again at Nick's house, Gatsby takes Daisy over to his house to show off how luxurious his life is now because he knows how attracted she is to money. Before this, Daisy only seemed mildly interested in seeing Gatsby. But once she sees how rich he has become, she becomes much more enthusiastic.
Gatsby's house does represent the superficiality of society, but I also think it represents society's view of the "American Dream." Society influences people, including Gatsby and even Daisy, that if you have money and you know lots of important people, you have everything you need to be happy in life and that's all anyone wants. But what they don't tell you is that the American Dream is a lie, money and fame can't always bring you happiness. Gatsby's house is filled with expensive splendors and whatnots and he has these extravagant parties all to attract this woman, but in the end money couldn't buy her love and it couldn't buy Gatsby happiness. When Gatsby died, no one came to his funeral because even though he had money, he didn't have many friends. His life was centered around his house and the superficial belongings inside to attract Daisy and when it didn't work he had nothing left to live for.
I agree that the green light shows how the American Dream is flawed. It represents Gatsby's dream of the ideal life: to be married to Daisy. He does everything he can to impress her, but still does not end up happy. "He had come a long way to this blue lawn and his dream must have seemed so close that he could hardly fail to garsp it. He did not know that it was already behind him..." Gatsby's dream is unreachable.
The green light is definetly important for that reason. The way money is viewed in the novel and in society, it is a must. Daisy said that she hopes for a daughter that is a "beautiful fool", because she is too smart for the society, and men were able to win women over with their money, and that is what Gatsby is hoping for. good post.
The green light is probably one of the most important symbols of the book. It represents Gatsby's dream, which is to be with Daisy. In chapter 1, Nick sees Gatsby reaching toward the green light in the darkness. It seems as if he is reaching towards the light to lead him to his dream. The green light could also represent the American dream.In Chapter 9, Nick compares the green light to how America must have looked to early settlers of the new world."And as the moon rose higher the inessential houses began to melt away until gradually I became aware of the old island here that flowered once for Dutch sailors' eyes- a fresh, green breast of the new world." (p. 189)
The most significant aspect of "The Great Gatsby" is what the green light represents: hope and the hope for money. What Gatsby hopes for in this novel is rather ridiculous to most, yet he puts all his energy and life into his object of affection, Daisy. While it is true that he never actually attains her, according to Nick "Gatsby turned out all right at the end" (6). On page 129, we can again see that the color green is a symbol of hope. Here Tom is at Wilson's garage with Nick and Jordan: "With an effort Wilson left the shade and support of the doorway and, breathing hard, unscrewed the cap of the tank. In the sunlight his face was green." While it may be referring to the fact that Wilson felt sick, it can also be interpretted as Wilson's hope to take his wife out west (130).
The Green Light represents, along with chasing our dreams, how our dreams can come to consume us.
Like a light, when you reach a dream, it’s always anticlimactic. The dream of Daisy consumed Gatsby, but when he actually attained her, it wasn't all that he thought it would be. He built her up in his mind, because like the light, he saw her from a distance, but when it comes down to it, the light was just a little light on a dock. It represents how we can build up an image or idea in our mind and follow after it, but when we actually reach it, its never what we thought it was. "Possibly it had occurred to him that the colossal significance of that light had now vanished forever." (p.98)
Dr. Eckleburg comes up frequently in the novel. His eyes "dimmed a little by many paitless days under sun and rain, brood on over the solemn dumping ground" (28). They represent how distant society is from itself. It's as if the rich part of society constantly watches over the Valley of Ashes. In addition, the eyes represent the always watching eyes of God, "'God sees everything,' repeated Wilson. 'That's an advertisement,' Michaelis assured him" (167). The advertisement represents some greater being that always watches over the ashes.
This is the most important symbol in The Great Gatsby. like Vasiliy said, it shows the all seeing eyes of God. Which is interesting because these people are doing what the Bible descrribes as being morally wrong, It's during the time of prohibition, which was put in place mostly for religious reasons, yet there are still huge drinking parties. There is this billboard that represents the seeing eyes of God, and Nick is the only person who notices. The people are too caught up in there own lives to notice anything morally.
T.J. Eckleburg is a large billboard with 'allseeing eyes.' I believe these represent the eyes of judgment over this corrupt upperclass society. It is interesting that Fitzgerald expresses the blue eyes being shaded by "yellow spectacles" since yellow represents dishonesty, I also believe that the allseeing eyes are 'shaded' with dishonesty. The readers tried to uncover the truth about each character, however they are given many perspectives to consider. An example of this is when Nick hears that Gatsby attended Oxford. Gatsby then proves this to Nick with evidence in the form of a picture of his Oxford days. Later we discover that Nick only attended Oxford for five months. The eyes of truth are clouded by the various accounts of Gatsby's education.
I agree with Gabe, I do not think that Eckleburg's eyes stand as the most important symbol in the novel, nor do I think that their, (in my opinion), lack in the novel serves as the keypoint in the story either. I just dont see how something so scarcely mentioned can be the most important symbol, I think it serves as more of a platform for the more important symbols, such as shallowness, corruption, and narcissism. Due to the absence of the supposedly judgemental eyes of Eckleburg, those symbols stand out more and are reflected in many more dimensions.
I agree with Dustin in that Dr. T.J Eckleburg is an very important character in the book. I remember in a book we read about how big brother is watching you and this symbol reminds me of that. Its shows how he sees everything that going on. Such as people seeing peoples sins in which they think is a secret. But i like how dustin brought up the prohibition because thats a really good point.
The most powerful and slightly concealed symbol is grass. When Nick is helping Gatsby plan his get-together with Daisy, they look at the grass at Nick’s house. Reluctantly, Gatsby says “I want to get the grass cut.” Then they looked at the grass, “there was a sharp line where my ragged lawn ended and the darker, well-kept expanse of his began.” (p.87) When Gatsby is worrying about his meeting with Daisy, he asks if everything is all right. Nick responds and says the grass looks fine to which the response is “ ‘What grass? Oh, the grass in the yard.’ He looked out the window at it, but judging from his expression I don’t believe he saw a thing.” (89) What Gatsby had seen as important was now the least of his worries. This partly symbolizes his corruption as a human being. He may seem different from the other rich people, but he, too, will see things as important (because of his money/position), but when he gets right down to the point of importance, and it really doesn’t matter.
The sharp line of difference represents the difference of his life and Nick’s and the difference of West and East Egg. East Egg, the egg of superior company, would never see a sharp line of difference of grass lengths. The green grass there is always perfect. (Like that perfect Walgreens world.) This important difference of grasses not only demonstrates the difference of Nick and Gatsby’s lives in society, but HOW Gatsby was different from those who lived on East Egg. (what made him “exempt from my reaction.” (p.6) ) Gatsby was exempt from the reaction because he could place himself on a plane with the other people of the world, in the ashes, rather than next to the other rich mansions, all for one person.
Gatsby and Nick live so differently, from entertainment to luxuries. When Daisy went to wash her face, Nick thought “in humiliation of my towels while Gatsby and I waited on the lawn.” (95) When Daisy was being introduced to Gatsby’s house, she toured the “gardens… and plum blossoms” and could see the incredible difference of how each man lived. Remember that the gay parties occurred on the lawn, occasionally looking like the “world’s fair.” (86) That ‘sharp line’ divided more than just two lawns. This striking difference between the houses on these pages created a powerful image of the man Gatsby had become v. the man he was/did not want to be.
“He must have looked up at an unfamiliar sky through frightening leaves and shivered as he found what a grotesque thing a rose is and how raw the sunlight was upon the scarcely created grass.” (169; end of Ch.8) A great example of Fitgerald’s style, a grotesque rose and raw sunlight on scarcely created grass is disheartening. This is such a depressing, yet powerful thought. This view of the world was discussed shortly before shots were fired. The powerful statement is filled with rich images and unanswered questions. Did Gatsby die a severely depressed man? The depressing view of life, roses, sun, and grass, seem to imply that he was more deeply troubled that he seemed.
Finally, after the death of Gatsby, Fitzgerald comments once more on the grass. (188) “Gatsby’s house was still empty when I left- The grass on his lawn had grown as long as mine.” The issues with the grass had gone full circle. The passage of time and fate is greatly illustrated here. Gatsby died, and life moved on. The grass continued to grow. But when Gatsby moved, time stood still. Everything at his home seemed to stop. The care of the house, the parties… understandably, it all ceased. Gatsby’s unique difference from the other people that ‘represented everything for which I have unaffected scorn’ was gone. (6) The grass’ tidy look was gone. The sharp line was gone. The grass had blended into Nick’s. The perfect grass had blended into the lifestyle that Gatsby never wanted.
You mention that the grass Gatsby's riches and the superficiality of it, but I believe that, as previously mentioned by Stephanie, the house represents his fakeness a lot more. As you mention, the grass represents a line dividing the rich and the poor, the old and new Gastby but I feel that the grass is not the most important element that shows this division. For expamle, the Valley of Ashes shows the separation more clearly.
The grass not only represents a line dividing rich and poor, but a representation for wealth. In the book Jordan Baker is a golfer, and golfers play on lush fields of grass. Wen Nick talks about the picture with Gatsby in it holding a cricket bat, it means that Gatsby played cricket, on grass. The grass symbolizes wealth and leisure, which is why it comes up in the story so often.
I agree that the grass is one of the less significant symbols of the book. Even though the grass draws up a line between the rich and the poor, the visual that it gives is not as strong as the Valley of Ashes, which clearly shows the division between the opulent, glamorous West Egg to the poor, dull Valley of Ashes, then to the elite New York City. Like Lauren said, I think that Fitzgerald added the symbol of grass as a supporting symbol for a much larger and important symbol.
I agree with Lindsay that Daisy does represent some women during the 1920's, but I feel that Jordan Baker represents the "new women" of the 1920's. Unlike Daisy, Jordan represents the break through of a new era in which women have a larger sphere of influence. She is a competitive golfer and has frequent flings with men such as her short relationship with Nick. Jordan is very cynical, showing her distrust to the public, while Daisy controls her emotions and knowledge of her husband's infidelity. Jordan is also very self-centered stating that even though she is a reckless driver, everybody else should be careful so that no accidents will occur. In the end Jordan tells Nick: "I don't give a damn about you now but it was a new experience for me and I felt a little dizzy for a while" (186). Her vulgar language contradicts the usual, formal, and polite way women talked before the 20's.
so I just typed a super long comment on this one and then my computer "timed out"...whatever that means.
But what I had originally stated was that I did feel Daisy represented the extreme characteristics of the era but I also felt that many of the characters could fall under this category. Considering that materialism is a reoccurring theme of the society in which they live none of them live realistic lives. They all live in a social bubble where they purposely are catty, shallow, and extremely naive. Many of the characters live "multiple lives" and the route they are taking is completely impractical. Family is an element of unimportance and it shows.
It is true that Jordan posesses a more confrontational manner than Daisy but I don't think that she is all that different from Daisy. She may be more openly cynical but deep down I think Jordan possesses the qualities that the women of this era were supposed to have. She still follows the "acceptable" protocol for a women. To address your point about Daisy, I don't agree that she controls her emotions very well. Daisy may seem flighty, but she's smart and the comments she makes reveal that she knows about her husbands affair.
The ultimate theme in the Great Gatsby is the inevitable passing of time and the eventual decay of the American dream.
The novel highlights the disintegration of the American dream. It is now in an era of unprecedented prosperity and material excess resulting in decayed morals and values. Life is plagued by greed, luxury and empty pleasures. The sudden rise of the stock market and new national wealth led to an unmatched materialism in the nation.
The American Dream promotes a person from any background to make a fortune and achieve their desires, but we see in reality and the strict division between East and West Egg that this is not true. The old rich scorn the new rich for their lavish and panache ways.
The Great Gatsby exposes the incessant seeking of this dream in a time when it has clearly decayed to nothing more than an empty book cover. In parallel, Gatsby longs to recreate his love with Daisy, but fails. In his first reunion with Daisy he knocks
The American dream has been reversed. Gatsby lives in West Egg and longs for Daisy in the East, a direct contrast with the traditional American frontier direction.
Gatsby chased and pursued Daisy for years, expecting things to be the same. Yet when he finally found her, his dreams were crushed, creating the "foul dust floating in the wake of his dreams". He refused to believe that the love that they once had would "decay over time". I really like what Kristy says about experiencing Gatsby's decay from the moment we meet him. I became less and less interested in him as we read the book because all of his secrets were revealed. He decayed as the novel progressed along with his dreams.
Fitzgerald does a good job of expressing this message through the characters in the novel. I don't think that Gatsby represents someone who always wants more, I think its more what like Kristen said, that the ultimately the American Dream is false. The American people during this era invested their money carelessly and lived in false prosperity pretending to live better lives than they actually did- as demonstrated through Myrtle. Though I do like the irony you mentioned in Gatsby's achievement of the american dream, I think that Fitzgerald is addressing more the emptiness and unhappiness of those who have money and those who don't- he uses the valley of ashes for this purpose.
I don't believe that this is about the decay of the American Dream. The American Dream is all about people making a fortune and achieving their desires. The East and West Eggers have all ready done that. Now they're just having fun and doing what ever they feel like doing. I think that the decay of moral values would be more appropriate than the decay of the American Dream.
The disintegration of the morals associated with the American Dream does nothing but change the American Dream. The true "American Dream" has always been associated with an honest, typically hard-working attainment of wealth. But, in The Great Gatsby we see the superficiality of all of these people who have supposedly achieved this dream. The book most certainly shows a change in the attitudes of these people, as they go from achieving the dream to being obsessed with out-doing everyone else who has gained wealth as well.
Both Tom and Gatsby want to recover a part of their past. For Tom, it was his glorious football days; Nick notes "...I felt that Tom would drift on forever seeking a little wistfully for the dramatic turbulence of some irrecoverable football game" (10). And Gatsby yearns to have Daisy for his own and to have the relationship they once had.
Both Tom and Gatsby are involved with women who are married. Daisy loves both Tom and Gatsby for their status in society and their materialistic possessions.
I dont see how tom and gatsby being involved with women who are married helps make this an important symbol. I do think though that Tom and Gatsby represents to different kinds of people. But i dont see how there relationship with daisy is an important symbol. Yes there relationship is an important attribute to the novel but I dont think it is very important. I think the meaning behind each characters are very important.